An interview with Jay Dyer

Conducted by Jesse Yelin

JESSE: Would you be able to give a little bit of a background on yourself, like what you do, where you're from, stuff like that?

JAY: Yeah, I'm a guy who studied philosophy in college, and then I studied literature. I tried to combine that with film and film analysis, and the weird and the esoteric. So I kind of took all my interests, and then smashed them all into a blog. And then eventually, when I did my grad-work, I tried to figure out ways that I could take all this stuff I'd studied and researched and make it into a living. I got sick of the world of academia and didn't want to be a professor anymore. So I decided to go with what I like to do, which was just immersing myself in the arts. And that led to a book. And that led to a second book. And that led to one season of a TV show, and then just kind of constantly promoting myself on the internet.

JESSE: It’s funny that you mentioned getting really sick of academia. Being someone who became more and more of a christian conservative over the course of college, the overly-liberal presence in academia was so obvious to me. Have you always had an interest for film? Or was it something that you cultivated over time?

JAY: I was always interested in movies. Back to the earliest days of when you start thinking “What do I want to be when I grow up?”, I always wanted to be an actor. I always wanted to be in comedy. My whole plan throughout high school was just to do stand up comedy. I had a routine that I'd written and worked on for multiple years. My senior year, I went to New York to audition at a bunch of clubs and at a bunch of amateur nights. When I came back to Nashville, I would go every weekend to the clubs and did amateur night. This was back in 1997. It was going good. I would say that I actually had some decent ability with it, but something about stand-up is that it is very difficult. So, I felt like it wasn't the means that would be best for me. Because I always liked sketch comedy or improv better than the traditional kind of “rote” form of comedy. Something about stand up itself is just cringey to me, unless you're lampooning stand up like Andy Kaufman.

JAY: I've always hated stand up deep down, even though I like comedy. But there weren't any improv troupes back then. There wasn't any kind of thing like that around Nashville. I decided to just give up that and pursue other interests. Then, I got really into philosophy, really into theology. So when I was at university, I didn't lose my interest in film, I just kind of put it on the back burner and got into other stuff. I read a whole bunch of philosophy and theology. I always found all those things interesting. Back in the mid 2000’s, I used to have a blog that was totally dedicated to philosophy and conspiracy. But I realized that nobody would click on philosophy posts. You get no traffic, no attention. So I just got back into the film and symbology aspects of this stuff just to kind of grow an audience. I mean, it's not that I'm not interested in those things. It's just that it's a much easier way to find common ground with people than trying to talk about Heidegger or something that nobody cares about, you know?

JESSE: That's interesting. I've known so many people who've done improv. It’s funny to imagine it being a hard thing to find back then.

JAY: There were no improv groups. There was like three, or two, comedy clubs that had an amateur night. One was Zanies. Zanies would charge you $200, and I didn't have $200 when I was 18 to join some Zanies frickin’ class on improv. You can either do improv or you can’t, you know what I mean? We'd already won a bunch of tournaments in high school for being on the improv team, so I was thinking: "I'm not paying $200 dollars to Zanies!” . There was another club called Comics, and that was a raggedy group of weirdos that would do stand up and some of the grossest jokes you can imagine.

JAY: Actually, one of the guys who I used to heckle, ironically, he's been on Jimmy Fallon and David Letterman. He's like a full on stand up now. And I used to heckle him back in the day. But there was only really one outlet back in 1997-98 if you were in the south, in Nashville. There weren't improv troupes. There's multiple improv troupes around Tennessee now, which is different. So once you once you got out of high school, there was nothing else you could do except go to these sh***y clubs and wait for improv night. The best you could hope for then was to host improv night. That was like a step up. You're always climbing this ladder. I was pretty ruthless, dude. I would just Heckle everybody, just sit in the audience and make fun of fat dudes t*ts and stuff. Truly try to get in his head and mess up his routine. So I was known as a really mean dude. But, anyways.

JESSE: So, where did your interest in religion and philosophy and government conspiracies come from?

JAY: That was born out of movies, actually. Because a lot of movies have always had these kind of themes in them. And when I was in high school, my crew and I were all movie buffs. We were into theater, we were into the arts. We liked women, by the way. We were actually heterosexual dudes. Back then it was like we were actually the cool guys! A lot of the films that we liked had conspiracy themes, but we didn't really know the nuance and the reality behind them. So it wasn't until I took some college classes on Oliver Stone films that I started realizing that Oliver Stone put quite a bit of history into his films. They're not all fiction. His films are kind of a midway between fact and fiction. So, it was in a roundabout way that Oliver Stone had a big role in that. And then other films that would be pretty obvious: "Conspiracy Theory", the Dick Donner film with Mel Gibson. That came out my senior year, and I remember that really stuck with me because there's a whole sequence where Mel Gibson undergoes this MKULTRA type brainwashing.

JAY: I was like, "What is that?”. And then at the same time, I think it was 1996 or 1997 when 12 Monkeys came out, and I always liked Terry Gilliam movies. That also has references to MKULTRA in it as well. So that put in my mind the seeds of interest in MKULTRA. It would be 10-15 years later where I really dove into researching it in depth. So for me, it was kind of like a crowning achievement when, after being back in high school watching Oliver Stone movies and trying to figure out what was going on, that last year, or the year before I was in a documentary with Oliver Stone. That was kind of like the crowning achievement of my life so far. It's on my YouTube channel. If you go to the top, you can see the Hollywood DC documentary that Sean Stone put together.

JESSE: Very nice! I’ll have to check it out.

JAY: It's pretty good. I recommend it. There's a part one and part two, but you have to be sure and watch part two, because I'm specifically in that part.

JESSE: It was around late 2019 when I started to get in to your work. The first video I saw was the Nick Fuentes debate.

JAY: Nick and I are on good terms, by the way.

JESSE: That's good to hear! I learned so much from watching that debate. It introduced me to the idea of Orthodox christianity as a choice over catholicism. How new is the addition of you talking about Orthodoxy in your videos?

JAY: That was kind of a unplanned indirect thing. A lot of this stuff actually snowballed. Originally, I was just blogging about movies. I had an old blog in the mid 2000s, where I did a lot of analysis of philosophy, and nobody would click on that stuff. They would only click on the conspiracy stuff. So I got rid of the old website and rebranded it in 2010-2011. I made a blog based around mainly movie analysis, but every now and then I would throw in a philosophy article. Or I would throw in a theology article here and there, just to see how it would do. And of course, the movie stuff always was like 10 times more of the traffic. So I would say in about 2014-15 I started integrating more philosophy and theology analysis. Then somebody was like: "You should do a debate". The suggestion was to debate Adam Kokesh. So libertarianoid Adam Kokesh somehow got roped into doing a debate with me. I don't even remember who set that up. But that snowballed into: "Oh, well, why don't you debate so and so?" That led to the J.F. debate. And that led to the Styx debate. And then the Matt Dillahunty debate and so on.

JAY: It's like this snowball thing that kind of unintentionally happened. And that led to just more and more of that kind of content, because people were kind of picking up on it. But I was doing that kind of stuff a long time ago, it's just that nobody would even pay attention to it. If you posted a theology thing, whether it's YouTube or a blog back in 2007 or 2008, you might get like 200 views max. So it's only gotten way more attention in the last four or five years. For anybody, really. You can go back to 2016-2017, where I was doing a lot of pretty hardcore theology type essays.

JESSE: When was it that you you converted to Orthodoxy?

JAY: Well, I didn't have an Orthodox church around me for a long time. But there's a lot of interviews and videos I did in 2016 about Orthodoxy. So I would say I believed it in 2016, but I wasn't received into the church until two years ago.

JESSE: Did you already pretty much believe in Orthodoxy around that time or were you still slowly learning about it?

JAY: I already pretty much believed it, before even the Kokesh debate. Because even in the Kokesh debate back in, I think that was 2016, I was arguing all the same stuff I do now. Like I said, it's a weird unintentional snowball. I didn't really plan to even be doing debates or talk about this kind of stuff, it just kind of happened. But strictly speaking, I already believed in Orthodoxy and had a lot of essays and articles. I almost became Orthodox in 2007. I got really close, but I ended up not doing it for multiple reasons. I had a fiancé at the time that I ended up not marrying. And part of the reason I didn't go into it was because we were going to that same church, and I didn't want to keep going with my ex. Aside from that, I had a phase where I got burned out on theology and philosophy for a few years, and then came back to it in about 2012. It was a long sort of 10 year process of me finally coming to Orthodoxy even though I kind of already believed it.

JESSE: Do you feel like the internet has made it easier for people to learn about Orthodoxy? Do you think that it has made it harder to find untampered Orthodoxy?

JAY: In 2006-2007 when I first started looking at Orthodoxy, I was a Catholic at the time, and I was starting to question Catholicism pretty heavy and the weird stuff going on there. And I wondered "Are there other options out there?". So I started looking into it. And at that time, there was maybe three or four blogs that had any kind of audience. So there wasn't much material out there. A few websites and few blogs with readership in the hundreds, not very big. It was very limited back then. And it's a lot different now.

JAY: Because there's a lot more out there, a lot more options and materials. But, I would say that the internet has been good for it overall. I mean, just in the last two years, we've created the stuff that I've been making. I get messages every day from people whose whole households have converted. I would say in the hundreds, maybe even in the thousands of men have come to Orthodoxy just from the stuff that I do. And I'm not trying to brag or like make a big deal about that. There's other people doing it too. Father Josiah is noticeable, and out there doing things. I'm sure he's lead countless people to Orthodoxy as well as many other people. So, I would say overall, it's been good. And we've only seen the initial "explosion" of Orthodoxy on the internet in the last maybe three or four years, in my opinion.

JESSE: Interesting.

JAY: I can't speak for other countries. But in the US, I definitely think it's growing. Although there are, of course, a lot of problems in the in the American orthodox circles.

JESSE: My exposure to religion nowadays was through these “Return to tradition” memes. I think there are plenty of other young men and some young women who can relate. What do you think are the pitfalls for someone my age (in their 20’s) who’s curious about Christianity and is exposed to it through the internet culture?

JAY: Yeah, that's a great question. My buddy David, who is a guy who left islam for Orthodoxy who's a friend of mine from the my Discord server, we did a talk just on that very topic. I'm going to answer the question, but if you want a longer discussion we did a two hour livestream just on that very question. I would look back on the mistakes that I made when I was 18, 19, 20. When I was at that age, I got really trad in the sense of being overly idealistic. So I'm not saying compromise on your morals, but be aware of being too idealistic. Because as you get into your 20's and 30's, you're going to realize that you're never going to smash the ideal into here and now. There's always this balance that you have to find as you mature, where you will learn that you can be realistic at the same time as not compromising your morals. But, if you try to be too idealistic and try to set up some kind of larpy-orthodox Imperium or some kind of trad Catholic Imperium, then it's just going to make you alienated and very unhappy. So, don't be too idealistic is the thing I would say to an 18 or 19 year old because that's what I did. I was super hardcore. I would go around door to door, I was trying to convert everybody. I was debating with my family all the time. So I would say don't don't go that route.

JAY: Have your views and relax. That's what I would say. Chill, relax.

JESSE: I know exactly what you mean. It’s so rare that we find someone who can accelerate bringing the ideal situation in to the here and now. And when we do it’s great. But being overly fixated on the ideal can also bring a lot of problems to those who are young and inexperienced.

JAY: Right. Like, when I was 18, 19, 20, 21, I was really into hardcore Calvinism. And it was an easy transition from that into traditional Catholicism. I became a trad Catholic when I was 21, I think. Maybe 22. So, there wasn't a huge transition other than some externals like: "Oh, I didn't believe in religious art before as a Calvinist but now I do". The rest of the theology is still super spergy-autist-intellectual. And then I had to deal with a lot of these things that I didn't realize were kind of my own issues in my 20s. And then as you get older you realize that you can't expect everybody to get a PhD in philosophy and theology. You have to go easier on people, and as you get older you do. You go a lot easier on people.

JAY: When you're 18, 19, 20, especially around 25, you literally think that you know everything. Like you've got everything and everybody's an idiot but you. And then once you make some mistakes, and you will because everybody does, you get a lot more mellowed out as you get older hopefully. I know that sounds like lame boomer advice, but I'm not a boomer. I did start the whole Boomer joke stuff, and now people call me boomer. People your age are like "Okay, Boomer", which is funny. But anyway, there's just something that comes with age. And I think this is why, not just the biblical tradition, but many religions have the elder as the wise guy, you know what I mean? The wise old sage is the old dude because he has the lived experience. And when you're 18, 19, 20, there's nothing wrong with being intellectual or hardcore at that age, but you don't have a lot of the lived experience of the mistakes that you're going to make that will kind of soften you a bit.

JESSE: That totally makes sense. I resonate so much with what you’re saying. I went through multiple periods where I overconfidently thought I knew everything and fell hard because of it. Orthodoxy has helped me balance everything out in my life.

JAY: Yeah, it's like a form of rehab. Father Deacon Dr. Ananias, someone that I do a lot of podcasts with, he called Orthodoxy a kind of rehab. I thought that was a great analogy. Because you get too obsessive over the intellectual stuff. And if you're a philosophy guy like me, we are used to solving giant puzzles. I always viewed philosophy like "Everything is this big algorithm, and I'm gonna solve all of this! I'm gonna read Hegel! I'm gonna read Kant! I'm gonna read Plato! And I'm gonna solve everything!". That's a noble task, I'm not denying that I still engage in that kind of an activity. But at the end of the day, you have to realize that's not all there is. Life is not just solving algorithms. There's also all these other aspects to life, like getting along with people, and male female relations. All this other stuff that's just as important, or perhaps more important than solving the giant matrix equation.

JESSE: So let’s say that you’re young like me, 21, and you're into Orthodoxy. What is the best way to find an authentic orthodox church without knowing so much about the religion?

JAY: I’ve talked to a lot of people who've had the same experience as me. I'd say that the best method for this is to, because some people unfortunately might be where they have to drive an hour just to find any Orthodox Church, so that might be your that might be your only option. But if you're in a big city or an area with 5 or 10 or 20, what I would do is take a Sunday and check each one of them out. See which one you think resonates best with you because not everybody's ready to be in a Russian Orthodox Parish. It's trad, but maybe people aren't ready to hear the service in Slavonic. It might be very strange to them. So in that situation, somebody might find an Antiochian or some other Orthodox parish better for them, with the liturgy fully in English.

JAY: A lot of Orthodox or Serbian parishes, they'll do half their service in english and half of it in Romanian or something like that. But sometimes those parishes can be a little more trad because the people are the kind who have spent centuries believing this religion. They're not so obsessed with Americanism, which you might get in certain parishes. There's no easy silver bullet solution to that question. So my recommendation is always to just test the ones around you and see which ones resonate with the most conservatism and traditional type of views, if that's what you're looking for.

JESSE: I agree with you. That helps a lot with finding a good church.

JAY: mean, if you find an Antiochian, Russian, Serbian or Romanian church, most of the time they're fairly conservative. I mean, every now and then you can find liberals there. The Greek Orthodox archdiocese is unfortunately the most liberal, they're the worst. But, there are some pretty based and pretty trad Greek Orthodox churches, usually if they're attached to a monastery. That's a good rule of thumb. This is true for Russian or OCA churches too. If they're attached to or close to a monastery, or if they're in a lot of contact with a monastery, then they're usually pretty solid. The ones that aren't are usually the more liberal ones. And the most liberal is the Greek Orthodox archdiocese, which I would personally stay away from unless you're in a situation where you don't have any other options. I went to one church recently that was connected to a monastery. It was very based, super trad. And it was more trad than some of the Russian parishes I've been to.

JAY: You just have to test and see.

JESSE: Moving on to the next set of questions: is there a connection between rave culture and government conspiracies? MKULTRA?

JAY: Oh yeah, definitely. We did a talk on this a while back, and we've been meaning to do a video or talk on this in the near future. I was always into EDM, all the way back to around sixth grade. But because I lived in the rural south, I didn't have access to raves. You'd have to go to pretty big cities back in the 90’s to actually find a rave. The closest thing you could find in Tennessee in the 90’s was if you went to Nashville, you might find a dance club that would play techno on the weekends. We did that a few times. But it wasn't some kind of big rave, you know? I was more of a nerd-outsider type of dude who liked the music, and most people aren't like that because they're going to party and do Ecstacy or whatever. I was just into the music, and I was a party dude but there just weren't raves around here. So we did a talk a while back, and if you're familiar with the book "Weird Scenes Inside the Canyon”, a lot of people link that with with my book. What Dave, the author, did in his book was take a look at the music industry - which is very similar to the way my book looked at the movies. And in Dave's book, he actually ended it with a chapter on the raw emerging movement in the 80’s of synth pop. New wave and that kind of stuff. Which gives birth, maybe indirectly, to trance and techno and rave and house and all that stuff, breakbeat blah, blah, blah.

JAY: The origins, I would say, definitely connect to entities that were doing research about electronic music. In fact, Aldous Huxley all the way back in Brave New World in 1932 predicted that the music in the brave new world future would be all just created by computers. It wouldn't even be musicians, it would just be these fake electronic "muzaq" type things. And I'm not trying to diss all electronic music. I'm still a big fan of a lot of electronic music, but I'm gonna be honest that it does have its origins in that. Now, on top of the social engineering, you also have the promotion of the rave scene early on in the 90s. The whole thing was about "global consciousness". Global DJs, global rave, global this, always promoting globalism. It was also always promoting the idea of a spiritual experience through the hallucinogens, right? My guess would be, since the rave scene kind of originates in the UK, that this comes out of the Tavistock Institute type of engineering. Because they were kind of connected to the Beatles. And a lot of the people in the music industry in the UK were behind the rise of techno and trance and house and all that stuff. I do think that there is a connection. But there's also a clearer connection I see.

JAY: I'm friends with kind of mid tier level techno people. People that would play festivals. Not the big bill, but the smaller bill people and people that had maybe two or three singles that were hits back in the 2000s. One of these girls was a medium tier famous DJ, and she broke down for me all of the ways that the drugs come to the raves. It's partly through people who are connected to intelligence agencies. Some of these Intel agency type people are connected to the different Mafias. Say, if there was a rave in Japan, you'd have to get permission from the local Yakuza to bring the ecstasy into the rave. Or you'd have to get it from them. So there's a close connection between all these different intelligence agencies and the local mafia with respect to where the drugs come from. And the bigger social engineering,

JESSE: That makes a lot of sense. Rave culture has been a long time interest of mine. Having done psychedelics when I was younger, I can see how easy it would be to push the globalist mindset on someone in that state. Getting in to a question I have about cinema, I have been really interested by the concept of predictive programming that I hear you talk about in your videos. It thought the James Bond talk you did was fantastic at highlighting how predictive programming has been used in our culture.

JAY: Was that the one where I had the ponytail?

JESSE: If you did, I didn't notice it. I think it was at convention, or something like that?

JAY: Yeah, that was 2016.

JESSE: With the coronavirus stuff going on now, I see a lot of people pointing to to films like Contagion or 12 Monkeys as examples of predictive programming. In your opinion, how do we determine when predictive programming is trying to be used?

JAY: Yeah, I mean there's not an easy answer to that question. It's a great question. If we go all the way back to the early teens of the turn of the century, British fiction writers a lot of time worked for British intelligence. And they had a pretty strict Official Secrets Act. They couldn't put things out in the news, so they pioneered this idea with the real stories that they wrote, putting them into fiction in a coded way. Graham Greene, for example, he did this. There's other examples, too, that I covered in my first book of British fiction writers who would were doing this even before World War One. It's actually a kind of an older thing, it's not new. There's many, many examples of this. The bond stuff was the focus of my master's thesis.

JAY: The reason I got deeper and deeper into that was because that's just one of the clearest examples of predictive programming. It's really just a form of propaganda where you're trying to utilize and prepare people for stuff ahead of time. Now, does that mean that in every instance you know for sure what each director or producer knew ahead of time? No. And I don't claim to know ahead of time or in every case. A lot of times I'll just say "I don't know if they did this intentionally". But we have significant amounts of evidence , and this has been written about by many scholars and many academics, that the Pentagon and the CIA all have consultants with Hollywood. They all consult on many, many films. There's at least two operatives that are former CIA operatives who do this full time. Their job is to do nothing but consult on scripts. Now, they don't just consult, they can also make alterations and changes and requests. The book Operation Hollywood covers this. There's the book by Trisha Jenkins, I think it's her PhD thesis that was on the CIA in Hollywood. And many, many other books have been written on this, which when I was doing my graduate work, I had no idea that it was this in depth. I just kind of thought sometimes there's coordination, maybe. It's way more coordinated than people think. But that doesn't mean that everything is coordinated.

JAY: So there's no easy answer to know what percentage is coordinated, it just depends. A big blockbuster like James Bond is way more important than some indie film, right? Maybe 500 million people will see the new James Bond movie. So the propaganda in that is going to be way more important than something else. It's just a rabbit hole that you can tumble down and it's never ending. And eventually find out that a lot of A-listers have been spies, and a lot of A-listers have worked as FBI assets and informants back in the 40s and 50s. People worked for the OSS, the CIA. More and more of this information comes out over time through the internet and what not. So it just becomes clear that a lot more of this stuff is controlled and planned than we think, but not everything. The global elite, they don't have God powers. They can't predict the future. But what they can do is embed messages into films that function as a form of propaganda and conditioning. And at the beginning of my second book, I cited actually a recent FOIA request where some 1000 or so examples in the last few decades of the Pentagon putting messaging into all kinds of shows. So this is not even debated anymore, it's public pentagon documents that show that they had purchased messages for shows as innocuous as Cupcake Wars and different cartoons. You name it.

JESSE: That’s scary. It’s weird seeing how imagery that’s associated with these conspiracies, like butterflies or teddy bears with MK-Ultra, gets put in music videos by these big creative people. And then it inspires independent artists to use the same imagery without many knowing its connection.

JAY: Yes, it becomes a marketing scheme. Then it becomes like a feedback loop. These kinds of symbols, the imagery that might have different meanings than what it's associated to in MK-Ultra like the monarch butterfly, it becomes a kind of branding tool to where it's all in all the pop music videos. Now every pop star has an all seeing eye, every pop-star has a butterfly. And that doesn't mean that in every one of those instances all those people who do the art direction on those films or those videos know the full story. They don't. They're just picking up on "Ooh this is hot! This is trendy!". I've had the benefit of being a B-tier e-celeb, I don't know what what the right term is, but what that does is it gives you access to some of the bigger named people. And then you talk to some of them and you realize that they don't actually know that much. A lot of these people that you thought were in on it at the mid level don't know what's going on. They might have a little bit of an idea. The higher you get up the pyramid, the more knowledge people have. And I would venture to say that not a lot of people have the full picture. They have little pieces of it.

JAY: In other words: No, Katy Perry does not know that much. She's not some master illuminati mage of the 33rd circle. I don't think she's that smart, but she has handlers and people behind her. Just like Elvis. Elvis had a famous military handler, the colonel who was feeding him drugs and all this kind of crazy stuff. You don't need the pop stars to have that much knowledge of the whole plan, per se, you just need people higher up that can call the shots that kind of know what the bigger point is. And in my view, the people that really know the big plan are the technocrats and the very top banking elite. That's who really knows the big plan. The Bill Gates, Rockefeller level people

JESSE: It’s almost like it makes it easier when these pop-stars aren’t smart enough to figure out what’s going on and just go with whatever their handlers push on them.

JAY: They're just advertising products. The pop stars are just products that advertise the ideology. They sell you on whatever agenda they're pushing lately. We see this with people like Brittney Spears. She started as this Disney teen, this innocent girl and then she turns into the whore. She's kissing snakes and s**t on stage. You can see the exact same thing with Hannah Montana. That whole show is hinting at an altered personality almost. I'm not saying that she definitely has an altered personality now, I don't know what her personal psyche is but she's obviously a victim or an abused person who's put out there to socially engineer girls who follow along with her career. They watch her go from being this innocent girl to this just crazed thing on stage. The way that I came to grasp this bigger picture, for anybody reading this that might be skeptical, was reading the top 40-45-50 books of the elite. The books from top technocrats and the top planners of the last century.

JAY: That's how I came to believe that this was totally coordinated. It's not because of me watching a bunch of music videos on YouTube with weirdos talking about all seeing eyes. I just went and read the elites themselves. They all talk about a coordinated plan. And they even talk about the usage of pop culture. In fact, that goes all the way back to Edward Bernays, the famous father of propaganda. He wrote that book Propaganda which I did a talk on a couple years ago. And they noticed back in the 20s and 30s that they could use pop culture to basically socially engineer.

JESSE: What’s scary when you figure out this stuff is that the information exposing it is very easy to access, yet no one seems to care.

JAY: Yeah, a lot of people are scared. It's scary when you first see this because it's so jarring to what you thought was reality. I remember that one of the reasons I quit doing stand up and all that stuff the normal way was because I realized that there's something off about this whole entertainment thing. I noticed a lot of people who were successful comedians back in the 90s, they weren't very funny. So I started thinking: "Well, how did they get there?". It seems like you would actually have to be funny to be successful. You couldn't just be a creation.

JAY: And then I started realizing that pop stars are just creations, they don't even have a lot of talent! They're these completely molded products. I realized the same thing with the comedy entertainment industry. It's not really about talent. There's a degree of talent which is involved, and I'm not saying that everybody in entertainment is not talented. But getting to be A-list, as we've seen now that all this stuff with Epstein is out, this is like a system that you climb up in tiers. And to go to the next tier requires more and more compromise. That's the key

JESSE: For sure. Before we end the interview, I have three more questions. First, is there anyone you’d like to plug?

JAY: That's a good question. I don't want to be unfair to anybody because we have a whole lot of people that are kind of in the inner and outer rings of what we do.
So I gotta give a shout out to my buddy Tristan at primal edge health. I like Benny Wills, Enjoy Camp, he's done a lot of good "woke" comedy in a good sense. Of course Sam Hyde, for sure. All the MDE guys, Charles, Nick.
Aaron and Melissa from Truthstream media, I mean they're they're making some stellar documentaries. They made the bestdocumentary on MK Ultra, "The Minds of Men". They put out quality stuff pretty consistently. Jimbob, of course, we've gotten to be buddies in the last year. He's putting out really funny stuff, good cartoons.
We've got a lot of guys in my circles in the discord who are starting to do orthodox content, which are good, David Snek, for one. We have people from all over the globe. It's pretty wild. We're approaching 2000 in the discord. And a lot of those young guys are making solid content.
Another person is blazeaster, I've been watching his stuff lately. I just followed him on Instagram.

JESSE: Second, what general advice would you give to the younger generation right now?

JAY: Now that all this "karunka" stuff has happened, it's kind of unclear where we're going to be In the next six months. But if things returned to somewhat normalcy, prekarunka era (which I'm not sure that they will but if they do), what I would have said to me at age 19-20-21 is to think about starting your own projects. Think about being an entrepreneur, think about having your own business. Do not think about trying to do things the "system" way. The internet, for all of its faults and cons, it also has provided a weird opportunity for people to make their niche and their interests a business. So I would say do that. Do not try to go get stupid degrees and get in debt. $200,000 worth of nonsense, you know what I mean? I would do what you're doing, try to turn your projects into things that get your name out there. It may take you 10 years. It took me 10 years before I could cease blogging for fun and move into doing this full time. But it is possible. If you're if you're looking for "What should a young dude try to do?", it's be his own boss.

JESSE: I love that. That's exactly what I'm trying to do with my directing.

JAY: You're doing it right! I wish I had done that at 19. Because when I was 19, I was thinking "I gotta get my degree, I'm gonna be a professor!". I should've gone back in time and just flipped myself off and slapped myself in the face.

JESSE: Finally, what’s advice you’d give to the Orthodox youth?

JAY: To stay reading the Bible, and attending the services. I don't mean in a mechanical way, but in a heartfelt way. Don't get distracted and lazy. Just stay consistent, because that's difficult for everybody. Even people who are super serious about Orthodoxy. It's still difficult to not get distracted. I get distracted with doing my content and then I neglect spiritual stuff. So I would just say to stay faithful to attending if you have the luxury of a church near you.

And the sacraments of course, and to stay focused on scripture.

Jay Dyer

Interview with Jay Dyer

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